Copyright Stan Fitton.

Provincial (Gosport & Fareham Omnibus Co)
1931
AEC Regal I
Reading FB35F

The Regent in the above shot was on the Crossley Omnibus Society Grand Southern tour and here it can be seen at the Provincial bus depot parked next to their number 66. Provincial had a tendency to get their monies worth out of the vehicles they owned and 66 was no exception. The vehicle was purchased from Timpsons of London in 1949 with the original registration of GN 7271, on arrival at Provincial it was immediately fitted with an AEC 7·7 litre diesel engine, rebodied with a Reading half canopy C32R body and reregistered as GOU 449. Ten years later it was rebodied again with the one in the shot above which was a Reading FB35F, it served a further 11 years at Provincial before being sold for scrap in 1970. This vehicle must be fairly high on the list of ‘longest serving vehicles’ at 39 years.
When David sent me this shot he said it was scanned from a very dark slide and he would understand if I did not use it, I think it would be a waste not to, especially a colour one and anyway David if you want to see a shot that should not be used click here.

Photograph contributed by David Beilby

Bus tickets issued by this operator can be viewed here.

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09/02/11 – 05:48

It’s a bit like the old story of Paddy’s brush – or Caesar’s original penknife isn’t it? Nearly everything has been replaced, but there is still a clear historical trail that says it is still the original! I do not say this in any sense of criticism – I grew up in Barton’s territory, and beneath some of their shiny "new" vehicles (well, bodies anyway) you could discover mechanical antiques continuing to serve their original purpose perfectly satisfactorily.

Stephen Ford

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01/07/11 – 06:15

Further photos of this vehicle with its original Reading coach body, plus what it might have looked like with Timpson can be found on the AEC Regal page at: //www.regent8.co.uk/ click on rotating arrow

Stephen Didymus

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01/07/11 – 09:22

As Stephen rightly says at one time there were many fascinating "enigmas on wheels" giving splendid service for incredible lengths of time. Perhaps the most spectacular that I ever actually worked on was Samuel Ledgard’s magnificent Burlingham bodied AEC Regal – it was a Birmingham Corporation Regent 1 of 1930, but how many happy day trippers to the seaside could possibly have imagined that?? It had been rebuilt by Don Everall of Wolverhampton – a Corgi model of it exists, but with a Duple body instead of the correct Burlingham, and the registration FWJ 938 – should be FJW – but a lovely model nevertheless.

Chris Youhill

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02/07/11 – 07:10

And here is The Maggot Wagon, Chris Y. //www.flickr.com/photos/21940361@N08/3883856963/

Chris Hebbron

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02/07/11 – 07:12

Chris, the same could be said of the coach just visible behind 66. It is either 68 (OCG 444) or 69 (PCG 436)both of which were chassis that started life as City Of Oxford Regents in 1932, and acquired as such by Provincial in 1940. 68 was originally 22 (JO 5406), whilst 69 was rebuilt from a combination of 20/21 (JO 5404/5). Both were given Reading coach bodies in 1955/56 and survived until early 1969.

Stephen Didymus

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02/07/11 – 12:07

Sorry for digressing slightly but FJW 938 seems doubly strange because it is pre-war, with a Regent (or Regal) II radiator and front wings and a Mk III bonnet!

Chris Barker

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02/07/11 – 16:24

It’s a shame that virtually no information is immediately available about Reading and the other Portsmouth bodybuilder, Portsmouth Aviation.

Chris Hebbron

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03/07/11 – 05:54

Thanks Chris H and Chris B – the bonnet and radiator are indeed fascinating features too – I wonder where they originated ?? – not from the shelves of a dealer in new parts I’ll be bound !! As the old darling is displaying "Otley" on the destination blind it has obviously recently carried "stage carriage" passengers in style and acoustic delight at absolutely no extra charge !!

Chris Youhill

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03/07/11 – 20:40

Chris H: David Whitaker has written an excellent book on Readings the Portsmouth coachbuilders. Titled "Reading First & Last", it is available from the Provincial Society website. In addition to many bus photos of Provincial, Portsmouth, and Channel Island vehicles, there are also a considerable number of lorries, ambulances and ice cream vans.

Stephen Didymus

Photo reproduced with kind permission of Alan Lambert.

Copyright Reading & Co

Portsmouth Corporation

1949
Crossley DD42/5
Reading H52R

Portsmouth had four Crossley DD42/5’s (11-14) delivered in 1948 and two (15 & 28) in 1949. The first four had German Imperial Navy-type crosses on the radiators: the last two had CROSSLEY plates on them. They all had Brockhouse Turbo-transmitters and, according to Michael Hampton (who commented on a photo of a DD42/7 I submitted earlier) retained them to the the end of their service days. The locally-built Reading bodies they wore had also been fitted to 6 Leyland PD1/1A’s delivered earlier, in 1947/48. They bore some resemblance (especially at the front) to the Craven-bodied trolleybuses Portsmouth had at the time, there is a shot of one here.
As I recall, and unlike the DD42/7’s, they seemed to be very coy buses in the fleet, usually working routes needing only one bus, or peak-time reliefs or, as here, at Clarence Pier, Southsea, working the Sea Front Service on a cloudy or chilly day in May 1961, in place of the open-top TD4’s.
Incidentally, since only a few months separated the delivery of these 42/5’s from the 42/7’s, were there ever any DD42/6’s?

Photograph and Copy contributed by Chris Hebbron

Thanks for posting the two Portsmouth Corporation Crossley’s. My how they bring back memories. When both these Crossley’s ran, I lived on the ‘Tipner Estate’, in Tipner Green. We always seemed to get the Buses on this route (service ‘O’ & ‘P’ that later became service ’13’ & ’14’), that were near their withdrawal time. The ‘Reading’ bodied Crossleys did indeed keep their Crossley Engines & Brockhouse Turbomotor Transmitter’s to the end.
As a kid, I would spend hours at ‘Range Green’ (their ‘Tipner’ terminus) as they used to reverse into the beginning of Range Green, to face the correct way in Tipner Lane for the return journey. You would often see the Driver standing up in the cab trying to move the stuck ‘direction’ lever, which looked just like a normal Gear lever which you pushed forward to go forwards and pulled back to reverse, between these was neutral. The trick for an easy change of direction was to knock the lever into neutral just before coming to a halt, then stop, then using the ‘Heel Pedal’ under the Drivers seat which was supposed to (but rarely did) stop the transmission from turning, snatch the direction lever quickly to the direction you want to go.

John

The O & P route was just the sort of quiet route these vehicles trod for year in and year out. Oh, and we always called Tipner, Tipnor – strange how it had two spellings.

Chris Hebbron

As it seems empty (look upstairs), do we take it that the rear suspension is a bit, shall we say, tired, or someone has left a very heavy parcel under the stairs? Or are all the passengers standing on the platform?

Joe

I love the thought of 52+8 standing, 60 folk crammed on the platform (probably having to leave the conductor behind!) but it may be that the bus is pulling away from the bus stop and causing the apparent tilt backwards and perhaps towards the camera a little, too.

Chris Hebbron

This is true,’Tipner’ was the correct spelling for that Estate, but there was also a ‘Tipnor’ spelling for a road just off ‘Twyford Avenue’ (probably doesn’t exist after the placement of the ‘M27’ Motorway build in the 1970’s).

John

The Reading bodywork was a very ‘handsome’ affair with clean cut lines, and polished interior woodwork with  half drop ventilator windows but sadly, this body, was not the most rugged or durable in practice. This would explain the early withdrawal of the Crossley’s and the PD1/PD1A with these bodies. This may also explain why the ‘Reading’ Bodied vehicles kept their troublesome Crossley engines & Brockhouse/Salerni Turbomotor/Transmitter Converters to the end.

John

Yes, I always had a soft spot for the looks of the Reading-bodied vehicles.

Towards the end, even the Crossley bodies on the DD42/7’s suffered from body problems. I can recall sitting in the front downstairs saloon seats and noticing that fatigue cracks were appearing in a central spar which ran below the windows. Several buses had had the ‘dodgy’ part covered in varnished wood, one must hope after welding work had been done!

Chris Hebbron

The number of dodgy bodies – and coachbuilders – from the end of WW2 to 1950 is legion, for the most part due to or contributed to by the lack of quality parts and materials as a consequence of the war.

Interestingly enough, you could say that Crossley bodies were of two distinct types – both generally regarded as of high quality.

Due to immense Manchester Corporation influence, the majority of pre-war – and post-war to 1950 – bodies were on Metro-Cammell frames (then regarded as by far the best and most reliable all metal frames). This, of course, made them compatible with most of the rest of MCT’s fleet of Met-Camm bodies. After the AEC/ACV take over, most Crossley bodies were on Park Royal frames (another quality product) but made them (like similar Roe bodies) into PRV clones.

A prime example of dodgy coachwork was Windover which was luxurious "in the extreme" but fell apart rapidly with it’s "green" wood frames.

David Oldfield

I have to admit, I did not know that C.P.P.T.D. Had had trouble with the Crossley Bodies too ! I do remember, as a kid, aiming for the single seat on either side which was located in the centre of the lower saloon (only on those that hadn’t been up seated to standard layout). The rore of the transplanted 8.6 Litre Leyland Engine, and whine from the 1930’s (ex) TD4 ‘crash’ Gearbox’s. I never remember any of them breaking down even though the engine and gearbox was over twenty years older than the rest of the Bus !!

John

I don’t think the comment about Metro-Cammell frames is quite right. Pre-war yes, Manchester had vast numbers of "Crossley-MetroCammell" bodies. But both of the seminal works by Eyre and Heaps ("The Manchester Bus" and "Crossley") state that post-war Crossley bodies used Crossley’s own framing, and speak very highly of it.
The Park Royal framed Crossley bodies should have been of high quality, but many of them weren’t, because by then Crossley was in its death-throes, morale was low and nobody was interested in quality. Preston is one operator that had to do substantial rebuilding work on these bodies.

Peter Williamson

In my copy above, I posed the question as to whether there had ever been any Crossley DD42/6’s. By chance, I’ve found out that, in 1949, Birmingham Corporation took delivery of eight DD42/6’s and one DD42/6T. This was just before their great influx of Daimlers, Guys and Crossley DD42/7’s in 1950. So if Portsmouth’s DD42/5’s were delivered in 1949 and B’ham Corp’n’s were DD42/7’s in 1950, not many DD42/6’s could have been made in the interim, but some were.

Chris Hebbron

The comments from Chris Hebron about the DD42/6 Crossley’s, reminded me of an almost identical scenario with the pre-war Leyland Titans.
There were TD1 – TD5 Chassis then a handful of TD6’s for one operator, before the arrival of the TD7 in 1942. The War stopped further production ’til the post-war PD1 with its rather ‘clattery’ E181, 7.4 Litre Engine.

John

Vehicle reminder shot for this posting

21/02/13 – 06:14

I recall reading once that Leyland’s 7.4 litre engine was originally developed for use in wartime tanks!

Chris Hebbron

21/02/13 – 07:14

Yes, Chris, and used in tandem – two at a time, like DMUs.

David Oldfield

21/02/13 – 08:43

Interesting. It may well be then, David, that all 7.4 powered buses were secretly part of the UK’s strategic military reserve!

Chris Hebbron

Photo by ‘unknown’ if you took this photo please go to the copyright page.

Provincial (Gosport & Fareham Omnibus Co)
1947
AEC Regent II
Reading H56R

The AEC Regent II was only in production for three years 1945 – 48 and just under 700 were made but at the time just after the war they were much in demand. There wasn’t any variations either it came with a 7.7 litre 6 cylinder oil engine, four speed sliding mesh gearbox otherwise known as a crash gearbox and vacuum assisted brakes, but on saying that it was well capable of doing the job and most of all it was very reliable. Of course there was a choice of body and the above bus had one from the local Portsmouth bodybuilders Reading who built and rebuilt quite a few buses for Provincial.

Bus tickets issued by this operator can be viewed here.

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When Provincial re-built their Guy Arabs with air-cooled Deutz engines, they built the lower decks of the bus bodies themselves, then sent the half-completed bodies to Portsmouth bodybuilder, Reading, who built the upper deck and roof. A strange practice indeed.
Reading also built several bodies for Portsmouth Corporation buses, too.

Chris Hebbron

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Provincial had 4 of these Regent IIs, numbered 10-13 (FHO 602-5). Strangely enough, no.10 was the only one of the batch not to undergo any significant rebuilding (with the exception of a minor alteration to the destination box layout in the late 1950s) and was also the last one withdrawn in December 1968. By 1959,11/12 were found to be suffering from body rot and were subsequently rebuilt using the wartime Reading bodies from  AEC rebuilds 14 (EOR 251) and 15 (EHO 282); whilst 13 was initially converted to open-top in 1958 following a collision at Fareham Railway Arch, and rebuilt to closed top once more by Reading in 1960.
For further photos of Provincial vehicles, here are a couple of links:
//www.flickr.com/ 
//www.regent8.co.uk/ (select ‘In Focus’)

Stephen Didymus

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14/07/12 – 18:29

Copyright Beckingtonian (Flikr) with his permission.

Here is a colour photo of a very smart No. 10, taken in 1968, just a year before its withdrawal, as scrap, in April 1969, after a creditable 22 years of service.

Chris Hebbron