A Page of Omnibuses

Continuing with photos from an album.

In an album of 'Old Cars Abroad' I recently acquired, is an out-of-place page of omnibuses, which I opine would bring more pleasure to this forum than to many others!

Victor Brumby
03/2016

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13/03/16 - 06:38

Victor, some wonderful photographs there, most interesting. The T.Jones and Son Crossley coach does have a Gurney Nutting body, absolutely no doubt about that.
I'm intrigued by the West Hartlepool Daimler because the Roe body looks far too old to date from 1958, I would suggest that it was simply rebuilt from centre entrance to rear entrance rather than rebodied. The extra long window bay in the middle seems to be evidence of it's former guise.

Chris Barker

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13/03/16 - 10:33

It’s amazing what surprises come up when you buy scrapbooks of photos, Victor, and these certainly tick all the boxes for me! Thanks for sharing.
Chris B stole my thunder with his two observations; nevertheless, those full-fronted Middlesbrough Lolines ‘Queen Mary’ clones always looked impressive, but I’ve only just noticed that they appear to have had Cave-Brown-Cave heating, unusual on a non-Bristol vehicle.
And I always welcome views of rare beast Leyland Titanics; this one looking rather dated, body and radiator-wise, for 1934.

Chris Hebbron

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14/03/16 - 06:55

The Crossley bodied Leyland PS1 of Blackburn Corporation prompts a comment from me. The patent Crossley windows at the rear end look, from this photograph, to have been applied only to the nearside. I'm sure this wasn't the case, as they formed part of the weight bearing structure and would have been needed on both sides.
But 'looking through' to the offside rear windows, they do look to be deeper than their counterparts on the nearside.

Petras409

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The Doncaster Titanic was actually featured in the same photo submitted here by Nigel Edwards- apparently taken by C H Roe and credited to “Mr G Warnes”. The Doncaster numbering was confusing then, as the legendary 1942 Utility AEC which survived for 20 years was number 60! Contrast it with Williamsons 1938 Titanic on this site, formerly Doncaster 76, and you can see how far Roe’s had then moved on. Doncaster had Karrier 6 wheel trolleys as well as pre-war AEC Renowns, so 2 axles were definitely good for both capacity and civic pride.
These are splendid pics for spotting detail. Notice how the original Daimler CV radiator moves forward, Guy style, when it becomes a CVG: and another thing- the municipalities (except Middlesborough) only had a coat of arms in earlier days with the legal ID. Corporate identity came later! The Halifax pic seems to suggest that there was once an Alhambra to rival Bradford's- behind the bus?

Joe

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14/03/16 - 10:16

Another lovely random selection of interesting vehicles for us to enjoy. The West Hartlepool Daimler seems to be a real enigma If rebodied then surely it would have been more conventional than it appears. If, however it has been extensively rebuilt then it seems quite an outlay at ten years old. On busy urban services there is much to be said for centre entrances, as boarding and alighting passengers have at most only "half a saloon" to easily negotiate - thereby giving a great advantage to punctuality for the very small price of a few less seats during times of full loading.

Chris Youhill

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14/03/16 - 14:12

The soot-blackened Alhambra in St. James Road, Halifax looms large in the background of so many old bus photos taken in Halifax's Crossfield Bus Station. It was originally opened in 1840 as the Oddfellows Hall, a concert hall at which the composer Franz Liszt once gave a piano recital and Charles Dickens gave a reading of his work. Later it was used as a music hall, becoming The Halifax Peoples' Palace. Films were shown from 1917, and in 1920 it became The Alhambra Picture House. Taken over by the Corporation in 1955 it continued in the same role until closure in 1959, and demolition in 1964. After this the cleared site was used as a bus park, (replacing the previous park on the corner of Great Albion Street and Orange Street) and continuing for this purpose until Crossfield Bus Station was replaced by the new one at Winding Road in 1989.

John Stringer

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15/03/16 - 05:52

Crossley EY 9194 was new to Jones in 6/49 and fitted with a second hand Strachan and Brown B32F body. This had been new in 4/33 on AKK 517, a Thornycroft Cygnet of Weald of Kent Transport Company, Tenterden, passing to Maidstone and District in 11/33. Jones acquired this vehicle in 1947.
Jones had the Crossley rebodied by Gurney Nutting, as shown here, in 1952.
Information from the PSV Circle, which shows it as FC35F and FC37F in different publications.
The coach appears to be still with us:- www.flickr.com/search/?q=ey9194.

David Williamson

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15/03/16 - 05:53

Thanks for that information John, I was racking my brains to figure out the location - but I know that the Alhambra had long gone before I could picture things. Didn't the bus park that replaced it have a primitive shelter down one side where school specials to "School Base" (for those not familiar with Halifax geography this was a site in Holdsworth where four secondary schools had been built on adjoining sites) loaded? And I understand that there are plans to close the present bus station, and relocate to a site closer to the railway station.

Philip Rushworth

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15/03/16 - 05:55

The body on EF8286 was definitely a rebuild. A 1958 Roe body wouldn't have looked remotely like that one.
It's certainly strange that it was considered worthwhile rebuilding the bodies on 10-year old vehicles. Centre entrances fell from favour, but operators generally persevered with vehicles so fitted to the end of their natural life. There's a history of 1930s vehicles with forward entrances being rebodied with rear entrance bodies, but there may have been structural problems. It would seem unikely that there would be structural problems with the West Hartlepool Daimlers, since the West Riding centre-entrance Regent IIIs managed a full life, and they were Roe-bodied.
According to Peter Gould, West Hartlepool only managed to get a further 4-6 years use out of the buses in question, after rebuilding. He gives their original capacity as H28/22C rather than H28/24C as quoted by BLOTW.
The situation in respect of EY9194 appears to be as follows. In 1947 Jones acquired a 1933 Thornycroft Cygnet with Strachan & Brown B32F body, AKK517, ex-Maidstone & District 853. They ran it until 1949 then transferred the body to a new Crossley SD42/7 chassis, EY9194. The body lasted until 1951/52 when it was replaced by the Gurney Nutting one.
It is thought that Jones acquired a second ex-M & D Cygnet, did not use it, but transferred the body to a second Crossley, EY8671.
EY9194 was at one time preserved, being at the St Helens museum until 1999, but its subsequent history is not known.

David Call

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16/03/16 - 14:27

In my posting of 05:52 15/03/16, I missed a letter out of the website address I quoted. It should have been www.flickr.com/search/?q=ey9194.

David Williamson

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04/06/16 - 07:11

I think that you will find that the Yorkshire Woollen PS2 had already been lengthened and reseated to B38F by the time this photograph was taken. The whole batch was so treated and then some were rebodied as double deckers much later.
The "coach" livery was an attempt to "con" passengers that they were traveling on a coach to Blackpool Dewsbury Feast week. The lack of a boot lent the lie of course!

Malcolm Hirst

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14/07/16 - 08:36

I would like to point out that the photos on this page would almost certainly have been taken by Reg Wilson who was a bus enthusiast and the author of at least one bus book. This is not in any way a complaint about breach of copyright, but rather I want to pass on this information – as he was the photographer I think this should be acknowledged.I would like to point out that the photos on this page would almost certainly have been taken by Reg Wilson who was a bus enthusiast and the author of at least one bus book. This is not in any way a complaint about breach of copyright, but rather I want to pass on this information – as he was the photographer I think this should be acknowledged.

John Harrison

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14/07/16 - 16:27

You can say that again, John (!)

John Stringer

 

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